Days Black People Not Re-Enslaved By Trump

Thursday, April 10, 2008

Sean Bell Watch:The Grand Jury Testimony Of Isnora and Oliver.

Unfortunately since the detectives in question did not take the stand we were unable to put their story to the test and therefore we only can go by the testimony they gave to the grand jury. Let us look at the testimony given by Isnora.

On page 2226 we find:

He stood right next to me and we were both waiting

basically to point out the individual with the White Sox

hat and the long sleeve shirt.

This White Sox wearing man is the man that Isnora said was in the club and had made a motion to his hip that Isnora took to mean that the man was armed. Thus far this White Sox man is the only person who could arguably be thought of as posing a "threat" to anyone. He continues:

Several moments after

there was a group of males that exited the club. I

would say maybe about seven or eight. They exited the

club and they were hovering close near the front

entrance of the club and more where I was standing but

closer to the street where I was basically by the gated


This would be the group that contained Sean Bell and his friends.

We both were standing out there and we were still

waiting for the individual to come out which we haven't

seen yet and we, you know, began to hear like a loud

commotion, like an intense argument between the group of

males that came out and the female that was with the

owner of the black SUV and it was like a big argument

So Isnora and co. are still waiting for this "White Sox hat" wearing male. No one in the group of seven match that description and so as far as we know the only person who could arguably pose any danger was still in the club.

While we were in front of the club and

the argument between both parties, the female and the

group of guys that was there, and basically the female

was stating that she wasn't going back with the group

of males, I guess to a hotel, whatever she said, I'm not

doing you guys, and the individual that was with the

female, the guy, the owner of the SUV, he stood there

and I don't know what he said but he directed comments

to Guzman and the group of guys that was there.

What is significant here is that Isnora who is so keen to have heard "get my gun" and apparently close enough to hear this conversation between the SUV guy and his "chick" couldn't quite make out a portion of a conversation between said SUV guy and Guzman. Yet he describes this as a "loud commotion, like an intense argument." How then is he going to "not hear" part of said loud conversation?

So shortly thereafter I heard Guzman say get my gun, get my gun. He was facing the owner of the black SUV. He said get my gun, get my gun, and I hear Bell say -- I don't curse -- he said let's fuck him up.

So let's get it straight. Isnora briefly lost his ability to hear and then hears "go get my gun" and "let's fuck him up." Nor did he see anything that may have prompted this alleged statement. Then Sean Bell and co are off walking to their vehicle.

Once I informed the Lieutenant of the direction

where the group of males were going, he instructed me to

see where they were going, follow them, follow where

they were actually going. I did not follow closely

behind them because I didn't want them to think that I

was with the individual with the SUV to retaliate after

what just happened so I gave them enough room so they

couldn't see somebody was following them.

This is pretty important here. Anyone who is street wise knows full well that if you see someone following you, but acting like they aren't following you, you are likely to become a victim of a stickup, at best. What is important here though is that Isnora admits that his very presence and actions could lead Bell and Co. to believe that he was associated with the Black SUV man. Therefore Isnora's testimony actually corroborates the testimony of Guzman who said that he thought that Isnora was out to kill them.

I had taken out my shield from my

pocket, I had clipped it to my collar of my sweater, my

neck area, I clipped it there. Once I had clipped it, I had held it for several

moments as I passed the group on the corner because I

didn't want to tip anybody off as to, you know -- I

guess I didn't want to tip them off who I was and so I

removed my service weapon as I crossed the street and I

noticed the vehicle was parked, the headlights were on

and as I walked towards the vehicle area, I noticed Bell

and Guzman in the front seat.

Pg 2272:

Q. You were holding your firearm with your right arm

extended forward, is that fair to say?

A. Yes.

And so we have Isnora with his badge hidden rounding the corner. Then we have Insora, right handed with his gun pointed at the front of the Altima. Isnora is illuminated by 2 ~55 Watt bulbs off the Altima's headlights standing as he put it, less than 6 feet away from the vehicle gun up towards Bell and co. holding the gun with one hand (later testimony) that in all likelihood interfered with Bell, and Guzman's ability to see Isnora's badge.

So again, Isnora's actions played out exactly as he had thought about. He appeared to be a member of the other entourage.

I had eye contact

with him from the beginning when I first got to the

vehicle, and after it struck my leg, I maintained focus

on Guzman only because when he said get my gun, get my

gun so I felt in my mind something's up here, why, you

know, they racing out of the location.

Why? Since we know they had no gun and had not committed any crime whatsoever, they perhaps thought, as Isnora suggested, that they were about to be killed by the SUV guy or one of his boys. What if Isnora had followed his early concern that maybe he would be seen as such a person?

I was watching the passenger side and I noticed that he kept

reaching in his waistband area, but all the while I kept

saying police, don't move, police, don't move. I said

it several times and I know they saw my shield because

it was clipped on my collar area.

He knows? He KNOWS that Guzman can see his badge? How does he know this? Can he read minds? Perhaps Isnora knows Guzman saw the badge the same way Isnora saw everything else around him, such as in this statement:

Pg 2273:

Yes. In the midst of what transpired -- a lot of

times -- I don't know how to explain it, but it felt

like I couldn't hear nothing, it was like sketchy. I

don't know how to explain, but --

Q. Would it be fair to say you're trying to describe

like a kind of tunnel vision where you're focused?

A. Yes.

Pg 2275:

I was able to see the individual, but, like I

said, it's sketchy. Like I said, when you have tunnel

vision, it's just -- I don't know how to kind of paint

the picture to explain that my vision was just solely on

this individual and nothing else.

Pg 2277:

Well, after the firing had ceased, that's when I

noticed he was around my side. Like I said, when I was

firing, I couldn't tell exactly where each individuals

were. My tunnel vision blocked everything, all my

peripheral vision.

Pg 2293:

Q. Did you at any point realize that there was no

threat coming from inside the vehicle?

A. I could not tell.

Q. Did you ever pause in your gunfire to assess

whether there was a threat coming from inside the


A. No, because I was so scared and in my mind as to

what happened before all the way up to that point, like

I said, tunnel vision I just couldn't. I wasn't able to

Is it not entirely possible that Guzman and Bell were so fixated, "tunnel visioned" as Isnora put it on the gun in the right hand of Isnora that they didn't see anything else? hmmmm?

I seen -- I was

watching the passenger side and I noticed that he kept

reaching in his waistband area, but all the while I kept

saying police, don't move, police, don't move. I said

it several times and I know they saw my shield because

it was clipped on my collar area. I noticed that his

arm was going up in an upward motion and I yelled gun

and my mind, I felt that he had a gun and I couldn't

wait anymore. I don't know, it happened so quick.

So Guzman is reaching into his waistband area. Diallo was reaching for his wallet. Guzman apparently was reaching for or putting down his phone. In either case:

1) Neither one is a crime.

2) Insora still hasn't seen any weapon.

Now as to the hands going up. Lets take the assumption here that Guzman had in fact thought Isnora was an officer. That is not testimony anywhere, but we're going to take Isnora's word for it, that Guzman did in fact think that Isnora was a officer of the law and heard the commands Isnora was issuing. What were those commands?

Pg 2268:

Q. Now, after the vehicle has hit you, do you shout

any additional commands?

A. I just remember I kept saying police, don't move,

put your hands up, police, don't move. It was quick and

I was scared.

Q. Did you also ask them to show their hands?

A. Yes, in the midst of me saying police, don't

move, I said show me your hands.

Q. Basically you said police, don't move, police,

don't move and additionally you said show your hands,

show your hands?

A. Yes.

Q. You said you then observed movement by Mr. Guzman

within the vehicle, is that correct?

A. Yes. Like he just -- I kept -- like I said, I

kept my focus on to the side in the passenger window and

I kept noticing the waistband movement with both hands

as he is going to reach for something in his waistband.

Q. Could you tell for certain that he wasn't putting

on a seat belt?

A. No, he was not putting on a seat belt.

Q. How could you be certain of that, you saw

movement around his waist?

A. Because he is actually reaching like this, he is

not going like this.

Q. So now you also said show your hands, is that


A. Yes. I stated police, don't move, police, don't

move, then show your hands, show your hands.

Q. Do you see a problem in giving those two orders

at the same time, don't move and show your hands?

A. I'm not too sure as -- I mean, I am trying to say

I was nervous and all I kept thinking was that the

individual had a gun.

So the actual set of commands from Isnora was to stop and "put up your hands" Again, assuming that Guzman was following directions from Isnora, he would have had to move his hands up from his waist. That would mean that Guzman, by Isnora's grand jury testimony, the only testimony we have from him, was in a no win situation. Had he not put up his hands, he would be disobeying a direct police order and be shot. If he puts up his hands, from his waist where they were claimed to have been, then he would be shot because Isnora had determined in his own mind that Guzman had a weapon. And remember, this assumes that Isnora is telling the truth and everyone else is lying. By Isnora's testimony, Guzman and Bell were essentially dead men walking. Isnora, like Judge Dredd, had already judge them guilty of a crime (apparently conspiracy to commit a drive by) and had determined that it was his place to execute punishment. Isnora's testimony is full of I'm sure he had a gun. I'm sure there was a gun. There is no testimony that he saw a gun at any point during the entire sting operation. Isnora saw what he wanted to see and assumed that which he wanted to assume.

the SUV, black SUV, because of

what transpired earlier. I'm sorry, I am just -- once I

seen the arm go up, I fired. I yelled gun and I fired.

In my mind I knew that he had a gun in my mind and, like
I said,

So giving an order to "put your hands up" a suspect does just that and Isnora tries to kill him.

Q. Again, you had given a command show your hands,

is that correct?

A. At that moment?

Q. Earlier.

A. Earlier I know I said police, don't move, police,

don't move.

Q. When you saw the hand come up, did you see

anything in the hand?

A. No. To be honest, I didn't see. My thing was

that I wasn't going to wait to see what was coming up.

What took place prior with the argument all the way to

that led to -- in my mind I felt he had a gun and I

felt -- like I said, that was the last thing I wanted to

do, but I don't know how to explain because everything

-- just my vision was toward him and it felt like

everything was a little bit blurry to the side. I don't

know how to --

Did you see anything in the hand? No. I wasn't going to wait and see. Translation, I had determined he was a threat on the basis of a partially overheard conversation, the entire contents of which I did not get. Nor was I situationally aware to know that the persons who would have been the object of the supposed drive by had left the scene.

Q. Would it be fair to say that based upon the

action you were taking it was your intention to either

kill or disable him at that point?

A. No. My intention was not to kill the individual.

My intention was, as I was trained to shoot center mass

and for the -- how do I say -- for the threat to stop.

Q. Center mass is a term for the torso area of the

body, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. You're trained to shoot at center mass because

that's where just about all the vital organs are in the

body, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And because shots to center mass would be the

most injurious in all likelihood, is that correct?

A. Well, to my summation, like I said -- ask the

question again.

Q. I am just saying, you were saying you were aiming

your rounds at center mass because of your training and

we are saying that you're trained to shoot at center

mass because that's where mainly organs are, is that


A. Well, all the vital organs, yes, are center mass,

but that's how we were taught and we were taught to stop

the level of threat.

Stop the level of threat. What threat? The one entirely in Isnora's mind.

Q. Did you at any point while you were firing your

weapon see Mr. Guzman trying to escape across the front

seat to the driver's side?

A. No, I can't tell. The only thing I can say was

in my mind he was going to his waistband, he was coming


Q. So you never did see if Mr. Guzman was trying to

evade the gunfire, for example?

A. Meaning if I can tell or --

Q. Yes. If you saw movement in the car which you

concluded he was trying to escape being hit by your


A. No.

Well both the evidence and Guzman's testimony point out that Guzman did in fact try to get away from the bullets being fired at him. So again, Isnora, fearing the imaginary gun could not even tell that Guzman, the victim, was trying to get away from the gun fire, a completely natural reaction to being shot at.

Q. What movement did you see after you began to fire

your weapon?

A. I just saw the muzzle flash. I just couldn't


Q. Did you at any point realize that there did not

appear to be gunshots coming from that vehicle?

A. I'm not sure. I mean -- can you repeat the


Q. Did you at any point realize that there was no

threat coming from inside the vehicle?

A. I could not tell.

Q. Did you ever pause in your gunfire to assess

whether there was a threat coming from inside the


A. No, because I was so scared and in my mind as to

what happened before all the way up to that point, like

I said, tunnel vision I just couldn't.

So apparently Isnora had gotten a good look at the front of his gun and never, as indicated before, attempted to verify that he was in fact threatened with anything other than perhaps a vehicle 1 foot in front of him, which he could have easily gotten away from.

Now let us move to the grand jury testimony of Detective Oliver, who like Isnora decided, as is his right, to not testify. We find the following:

When I made the

right-hand turn I was still just looking a little to the

left and a little right, and started thinking maybe he's

just by himself walking on the street, and I still

didn't see him, and then maybe a second later I looked

to my left, and I saw Detective Isnora either on the

sidewalk or on the street, but right by the curb

standing at a car. Immediately thereafter, I just see

the tires screeching, and the car just came at me, and

hit my van head on, it smashed into us head on. I was in

shock at that point, and immediately the car went into

reverse, again, and the car came back at Detective

Isnora who was again either on the sidewalk or right on

the street by the curb, and I saw him jump out of the

way, and the car, the rear of the car, hit the building,

and as soon as it hit the building again it started to

come back at me, and that's when I saw Detective Isnora

with his arms out, and his gun in his hands yelling,

he's got a gun, he's got a gun, and then right before

the car hit us again for the second time I saw the

passenger window get blown out, and I saw shooting at

him, and the car hit us, and I heard the engine revving.

We should note here that Detective Oliver did not testify that he heard Isnora prior to the "screeching tires" yelling any police commands. Isnora testified that he had been yelling police commands at such a loud voice that he was sure that Sean Bell and co heard him. Yet detective Oliver heard no such yells. Who's lying?

Secondly Oliver testifies that he heard Isnora say "he's got a gun!" then then sees the passenger window blow out and says he saw shooting "from the car." Yet we know there was no shooting from the car. Therefore we can safely say that Oliver assumed that there were shots from the car because he chose to believe what Isnora had shouted. The fact is that neither Isnora, nor Oliver saw any weapon whatsoever.

I put my car into park, and I heard shots just coming

from the car. Immediately I got out of the car. I

yelled, police don't move, and I still see a passenger

appearing to be raising a gun. So I started firing my

weapon. It would only seem like a second or two.

How can he have heard shots coming from the car? He can only say that he heard shots. It’s not like he said “I heard bullets whiz by my head” or “bullets hit my vehicle.” So again, his testimony makes assertions he simply cannot prove and that the evidence does not support..

Secondly, How can he state that he “saw a passenger appear to be raising a gun?” He saw no gun. Isnora saw no gun. All they saw was arm movement.

I looked at my gun. I didn't know if it had any bullets or

something was wrong. I was standing right in front of

him. I see him lifting his arms. I didn't want to die. I

reloaded the gun, and I continued to fire, and the shots

still are going on around me. I don't know where they

are coming from, and all of this is happening in a

matter of a couple of seconds, which it seemed.

So detective Oliver was standing right in front of Guzman and could not tell whether or not he had a gun in that “raising hand’? Shots going all around him and he hasn’t determined that there is no shooting coming from the raising hand, which by his own admission had not been raised enough to get a shot at him even if Guzman had a gun? Do we understand what Oliver is saying? He knew there were no shots coming from the “raising hand” because he said he didn’t want the hand to get to a position where it could shoot him. Therefore he knew he was shooting at a person who was not firing at him and had not fired at him.

Q. At that point you hear that, is that when the car

is going into reverse and before it hits the wall or

after it hits the wall?

A. After it hits the wall.

Q. You hear Detective Isnora say, he's got a gun?

A. Yes.

Q. You could see the front passenger and driver in

the vehicle, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you see a gun?

A. No.

Did he see gun? No. Refer to my previous paragraph.

Q. Please indicate once you left your car what

position you took on the street?

A. I got out of my car over here, and I had my

weapon drawn, and I yelled, police don't move, and I

walked to this general area right over here, and I was

looking, and I began firing from this position over


Q. Let me make a record.

MR. TESTAGROSSA: The witness has indicated

that he took a position approximately six feet

away from the car.

Q. Does that sound fair, Detective, five, six feet?

A. Maybe six to ten feet, in that general area.

Q. And apparently directly across from the passenger

front door of the vehicle?

Oliver saw no gun. Oliver felt so comfortable that he didn’t run, he didn’t duck, he simply got out of his vehicle, weapon drawn and walked six to ten feet from his vehicle to the passenger side of the Altima where he previously claimed he thought gunfire was coming from. Is it police training to walk towards a place where you think someone is shooting from? Does that sound right to you?

Q. That was the position you were standing in and

that's where you began to fire?

A. Yes.

Q. At this time the passenger side window was

already blown out of vehicle, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. You could look into the vehicle and see the

occupants since there was no longer a window there, is

that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. So you could see a person in the front passenger

seat, and a person in the front driver's seat as you

started to fire your weapon, is that correct?

A. I never saw the driver. I could only see the


Q. You never saw the driver?

A. No, sir.

Q. Now, you began to fire your weapon. What was your


A. It was the passenger.

Q. Now, you could look into the vehicle and see the

passenger, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Detective Oliver could not see any part of the driver? Ok I’m game. That would mean he was so close to the vehicle that he could only see down into the passenger seat, in which case he could have easily seen any weapon that would have been there. He saw no weapon but continued to fire anyway.

Q. You indicated also that when you fired your

weapon the passenger side window is blown out, and you

can see into the interior of the car, and you could see

the person in the passenger seat, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you see a gun in that person's hands?

A. No.

From his own mouth.

Q. By the way, did you see whether Detective Isnora

had a shield on at that time? Well, at that time when

you first get out of your car did you see a shield on


A. I didn't even see Detective Isnora until I exited

my vehicle.

Q. You did see him before you exited the vehicle, is

that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. Had you seen a shield on him at that time?

A. I don't recall.

The first time he saw Isnora is when he exited the vehicle? But he already said that when he turned down the street in the p-van, he saw Isnora. So either he saw Isnora before exiting the van or he didn’t.

Now here comes the execution:

Q. And what did you see this person doing at that


A. I saw the passenger of the vehicle. The window

was blown out, and he kept moving like this as to

indicated he was trying to raise his arm, and I didn't

want him to get that arm up.

Q. Just for the record, you are indicating that the

man in the passenger seat was kind of twisting towards

the interior of the car?

A. No.

Q. Why don't you clarify that?

A. What I saw was the passenger of the vehicle, he

kept trying to raise his right arm as to bring a gun up

to me the whole time. I didn't know if he could have

been shooting through the vehicle because he couldn't

get his arm up. I was not about to let him get that arm

up. I felt if he got that arm up he was going to kill


Q. Would it be fair to say, as you made the motion

that you just demonstrated to the jury where you

indicated this man was trying to reach for his waist you

were also lowering your left shoulder and basically

putting yourself in a position where your left shoulder

is also lowered to your waist?

A. I can't answer that, that way. I don't know if he

was tipping his shoulder. When he is trying to reach he

wasn't just sitting still, and moving his arm. He was

like -- he was trying to get his arm up.

Q. The motion that you are making now as you

demonstrate to the jury is an attempt to show the jury

the motion that man was making?

A. It was a motion that appeared to me that he was

trying to raise a gun at me.

Q. But the motion that you are demonstrating to the

jury is an attempt by you to show the jury the motion

that man was making, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And in making that motion you are tipping your

left shoulder, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. When this man, who you testified was making this

motion, he was in the passenger seat of the vehicle, is

that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And when he made that motion and was tipping his

left shoulder that was kind of pushing his body towards

the interior of the car, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And again you saw this motion, but you saw no

weapon, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. You fired that shot at the same time you saw this

motion, is that correct?

A. I'm sorry?

Q. You fired your first round at about the time you

first saw this man making this motion?

A. Yes.

Here we have detective Oliver backing the testimony of Guzman by showing that Guzman was moving in such a motion that would appear to be moving away from the source of gunfire. Oliver sees this, states that he didn’t want to gun, to which he had not seen and repeatedly states he had not seen, to be raised at him and therefore decided to fire, two magazines full of bullets.

Q. Where did you direct that round?

A. Center mass.

Q. You directed it at the man's torso, is that


A. Yes.

Q. What part of his torso was turned to you at the

time you fired that round?

A. Facing towards in his seat. It was just his side.

Q. So his side was turned towards you?

A. Yes.

And so Oliver admits that Guzman was facing his “seat side” that would be his back, to the officer.

Q. But there comes a time when you notice the rear

passenger and you directed fire at him, is that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And when you directed fire at him you see him, is

that correct?

A. Yes.

Q. And you don't see a weapon in his hands, do you?

A. No.

Q. How many rounds do you direct at the passenger of

the vehicle?

A. I'm unsure. I don't know how many. Everything

happened within seconds.

Right. So again Oliver points his weapon at and fires at a person he admits he saw had no weapon and posed no threat to him whatsoever. even more damning:

Q. Detective Oliver, you indicated that there was

one thing you wanted to clarify from earlier testimony?

A. Yes.

Q. Please go ahead.

A. You had said before that I had seen the rear

passenger window get blown out is when I thought the

rear passenger was a threat that's incorrect. It's after

I saw the rear window get blown out that I had thought

the rear passenger was a threat.

Q. Alright. So just to clarify, it was the rear

windshield that you meant, is that what you mean?

A. Yes.

Q. Alright. When you saw the rear window go out, the

rear windshield, go out that's when you saw the rear

passenger and saw the threat or what you perceived to be

the threat from that passenger, is that correct?

A. Yes.

So Oliver thought maybe Benefield was shooting out the back window? As in the opposite direction of him?

It is pretty clear by the grand jury testimony of both Isnora and Oliver that neither of them saw any weapon. Furthermore, detective oliver has admitted, multiple times, that though he was not threatened with any weapon, he continued to shoot at Guzman.

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